Kirk Cousins (Traded to Vikings)

[Reno Hightower]

I have rarely seen a QB do more with less. Kubiak has made it clear that he is the guy this year but his play has really defied conventional wisdom. The run blocking is as putrid as it was last season. The pass blocking has been getting compliments but how much as that has to do with Cousins's pocket presence and pre snap reads?

I am not sure the subject deserves its own thread but I think what he has accomplished this season cannot be overstated and he has essentially put the offense on his back. I don't think anyone saw this coming.

Thoughts?...

[Cruisin with Tooz]

Agreed 100% everyone pointed out his weaknesses every week. You don't think other coaches and gms saw the same things? Add in his age and he's a rental, and a 10 million payment, he really doesn't have much value. I also don't think he puts them over the top. He gives them solid play but in no way is a difference maker

You mention the fact that Minn will absorb that 10 million of KCs deferred salary, as if they did us a favor that should lower the compensation. The guy has performed like a 50+ million/year QB.

Cousins: 20 TDs 8 Int Comp% 64.1 Total Yards 2340 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 11 Rate 97.1
Mahomes: 14 TD 4 Int Comp% 67.3 Total Yards 2037 Yrds/Att 7.7 Sacks 11 Rate 101.8
Allen: 12 TD 6 Int Comp% 66.1 Total Yards 2027 Yrds/Att 8.6 Sacks 17 Rate 99.3
Wentz: 3 TDs 2 Int Comp% 48.4 Total Yards 357 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 7 Rate 68.3 (in 3 games)

And this is without any semblance of a run game to share the load, and without a legitimate #1 WR.

For the 1/2 year they will have him, Minn will be expected to receive 25 million in expected on-the-field value. They will pay 10.66 million for that value. Therefore his contract has an expected net surplus value of more than 14 million dollars. They didnt do us any favor by paying next years 10 million. They did themselves a favor. They got a steal. Paying 10.66 million for 25 million in value is a steal. We did them the favor. We gave up the 15% chance we still had of making the playoffs and whatever else he could continue to contribute to Mendoza's further development, all to save their season. And they should have paid more for this, not less. You dont reduce your ask when you are giving the other party a steal. Spytek screwed the pooch by not standing firm and getting more value plus a conditional pick deal here. He still had another 75 minutes before the deadline to go eyeball to eyeball and let the pressure build. Not doing the trade was justifiable from our standpoint. It wasnt from their standpoint. Minn was the party without the leverage, because their season was going down the tubes. Minn wouldnt make the playoffs with Wentz. They will with Cousins.

I call bullshit on the trade evals giving Spytek an "A". More like an "F". A strong case based upon the work of Massey and Thaler can even be made that he should have obtained more than the 2nd round pick (or the better 3rd round pick) outright, PLUS the possibility of an upgraded pick. In addition to other things, we traded away 14.33 million in net surplus value, which is the delta between the on-the-field value for 1/2 year (25 million) and what we would have paid for it (10.66 million). For the moment ignoring everything else we gave up (15% shot at playoffs; mentoring Mendoza; and having a more capable backup than AOC), we should have at least obtained the equivalent in draft capital of 14.33 million of net surplus value. What did we get back? The expected net surplus value of pick 96 (scaled to 2026 cap dollars) is between 2.08 million/yr to 2.34 million/year. Over the course of a 4-yr rookie deal that is a total net surplus value of 8.32 to 9.36 million, far short of the 14.33 million we traded away. Picks 64 and picks 69 have virtually the same values. Over a 4 year rookie deal and scaled to 2026 cap dollars, those picks are worth a total between 12.5 and 13.5 million net surplus value, still less than what was given up. And this just sets the floor for what Spytek should have obtained. There should have been additional compensation for forgoing our shot at the playoffs; and for the loss of mentoring. And beyond that, there is the issue of leverage, which we had and which dictates prices, as much as intrinsic value does. Spytek was absolutely fleeced in this deal.

[Aristo]

Albert Breer in his SI article noted our return for Cousins is the second-highest for a quarterback in-season over the past decade, with only the Patriots trading a 25 yr old Jimmy Garropolo to the 49ers for a 2nd rounder being higher. Yea I think we maximized our return.

But if we extended that 10 year time window back a bit, didn't we give up a 1st and 2nd for Palmer mid-season? I guess we can't expect the Vikings FO to be as incompetent as Hue.

[Hellbound]

You mention the fact that Minn will absorb that 10 million of KCs deferred salary, as if they did us a favor that should lower the compensation. The guy has performed like a 50+ million/year QB.

Cousins: 20 TDs 8 Int Comp% 64.1 Total Yards 2340 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 11 Rate 97.1
Mahomes: 14 TD 4 Int Comp% 67.3 Total Yards 2037 Yrds/Att 7.7 Sacks 11 Rate 101.8
Allen: 12 TD 6 Int Comp% 66.1 Total Yards 2027 Yrds/Att 8.6 Sacks 17 Rate 99.3
Wentz: 3 TDs 2 Int Comp% 48.4 Total Yards 357 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 7 Rate 68.3 (in 3 games)

And this is without any semblance of a run game to share the load, and without a legitimate #1 WR.

For the 1/2 year they will have him, Minn will be expected to receive 25 million in expected on-the-field value. They will pay 10.66 million for that value. Therefore his contract has an expected net surplus value of more than 14 million dollars. They didnt do us any favor by paying next years 10 million. They did themselves a favor. They got a steal. Paying 10.66 million for 25 million in value is a steal. We did them the favor. We gave up the 15% chance we still had of making the playoffs and whatever else he could continue to contribute to Mendoza's further development, all to save their season. And they should have paid more for this, not less. You dont reduce your ask when you are giving the other party a steal. Spytek screwed the pooch by not standing firm and getting more value plus a conditional pick deal here. He still had another 75 minutes before the deadline to go eyeball to eyeball and let the pressure build. Not doing the trade was justifiable from our standpoint. It wasnt from their standpoint. Minn was the party without the leverage, because their season was going down the tubes. Minn wouldnt make the playoffs with Wentz. They will with Cousins.

I call bullshit on the trade evals giving Spytek an "A". More like an "F". A strong case based upon the work of Massey and Thaler can even be made that he should have obtained more than the 2nd round pick (or the better 3rd round pick) outright, PLUS the possibility of an upgraded pick. In addition to other things, we traded away 14.33 million in net surplus value, which is the delta between the on-the-field value for 1/2 year (25 million) and what we would have paid for it (10.66 million). For the moment ignoring everything else we gave up (15% shot at playoffs; mentoring Mendoza; and having a more capable backup than AOC), we should have at least obtained the equivalent in draft capital of 14.33 million of net surplus value. What did we get back? The expected net surplus value of pick 96 (scaled to 2026 cap dollars) is between 2.08 million/yr to 2.34 million/year. Over the course of a 4-yr rookie deal that is a total net surplus value of 8.32 to 9.36 million, far short of the 14.33 million we traded away. Picks 64 and picks 69 have virtually the same values. Over a 4 year rookie deal and scaled to 2026 cap dollars, those picks are worth a total between 12.5 and 13.5 million net surplus value, still less than what was given up. And this just sets the floor for what Spytek should have obtained. There should have been additional compensation for forgoing our shot at the playoffs; and for the loss of mentoring. And beyond that, there is the issue of leverage, which we had and which dictates prices, as much as intrinsic value does. Spytek was absolutely fleeced in this deal.

Lol at everything, especially this team having a shot at the playoffs

[Attyla]

it was a great trade. In no world is he worth a 2. And it was a light QB market so they just bid against themselves. We didn't fleece them but they certainly did not fleece us. It was about as fair a market value for both sides as you can get. And the 10M? Yes, it had to be a factor in the negotiations. A for us, B for them.

[BoKnows81]

You mention the fact that Minn will absorb that 10 million of KCs deferred salary, as if they did us a favor that should lower the compensation. The guy has performed like a 50+ million/year QB.

Cousins: 20 TDs 8 Int Comp% 64.1 Total Yards 2340 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 11 Rate 97.1
Mahomes: 14 TD 4 Int Comp% 67.3 Total Yards 2037 Yrds/Att 7.7 Sacks 11 Rate 101.8
Allen: 12 TD 6 Int Comp% 66.1 Total Yards 2027 Yrds/Att 8.6 Sacks 17 Rate 99.3
Wentz: 3 TDs 2 Int Comp% 48.4 Total Yards 357 Yrds/att 7.4 Sacks 7 Rate 68.3 (in 3 games)

And this is without any semblance of a run game to share the load, and without a legitimate #1 WR.

For the 1/2 year they will have him, Minn will be expected to receive 25 million in expected on-the-field value. They will pay 10.66 million for that value. Therefore his contract has an expected net surplus value of more than 14 million dollars. They didnt do us any favor by paying next years 10 million. They did themselves a favor. They got a steal. Paying 10.66 million for 25 million in value is a steal. We did them the favor. We gave up the 15% chance we still had of making the playoffs and whatever else he could continue to contribute to Mendoza's further development, all to save their season. And they should have paid more for this, not less. You dont reduce your ask when you are giving the other party a steal. Spytek screwed the pooch by not standing firm and getting more value plus a conditional pick deal here. He still had another 75 minutes before the deadline to go eyeball to eyeball and let the pressure build. Not doing the trade was justifiable from our standpoint. It wasnt from their standpoint. Minn was the party without the leverage, because their season was going down the tubes. Minn wouldnt make the playoffs with Wentz. They will with Cousins.

I call bullshit on the trade evals giving Spytek an "A". More like an "F". A strong case based upon the work of Massey and Thaler can even be made that he should have obtained more than the 2nd round pick (or the better 3rd round pick) outright, PLUS the possibility of an upgraded pick. In addition to other things, we traded away 14.33 million in net surplus value, which is the delta between the on-the-field value for 1/2 year (25 million) and what we would have paid for it (10.66 million). For the moment ignoring everything else we gave up (15% shot at playoffs; mentoring Mendoza; and having a more capable backup than AOC), we should have at least obtained the equivalent in draft capital of 14.33 million of net surplus value. What did we get back? The expected net surplus value of pick 96 (scaled to 2026 cap dollars) is between 2.08 million/yr to 2.34 million/year. Over the course of a 4-yr rookie deal that is a total net surplus value of 8.32 to 9.36 million, far short of the 14.33 million we traded away. Picks 64 and picks 69 have virtually the same values. Over a 4 year rookie deal and scaled to 2026 cap dollars, those picks are worth a total between 12.5 and 13.5 million net surplus value, still less than what was given up. And this just sets the floor for what Spytek should have obtained. There should have been additional compensation for forgoing our shot at the playoffs; and for the loss of mentoring. And beyond that, there is the issue of leverage, which we had and which dictates prices, as much as intrinsic value does. Spytek was absolutely fleeced in this deal.

I don't think Spy was fleeced but he absolutely did not get max value and I dont care what anybody says. And again, people are assuming he's a 1 year rental there which couldn't be further from the truth. Truth be told, he could be the same exact thing next year for Minnesota and a rookie QB that he was this year for Mendoza. Which everyone on here was all about.

[Hellbound]

it was a great trade. In no world is he worth a 2. And it was a light QB market so they just bid against themselves. We didn't fleece them but they certainly did not fleece us. It was about as fair a market value for both sides as you can get. And the 10M? Yes, it had to be a factor in the negotiations. A for us, B for them.

For some reason some team always has to get fleeced. This was a fair trade for both teams and that's fine. It also makes it easier or more likely to deal with in the future. This whole leverage thing is dumb too. There wasn't a market for 38 yr old rental qb. We were ready to move onto Fernando and did so. This also will prevent him from looking over his shoulder when he has a bad game too

[Attyla]

For some reason some team always has to get fleeced. This was a fair trade for both teams and that's fine. It also makes it easier or more likely to deal with in the future. This whole leverage thing is dumb too. There wasn't a market for 38 yr old rental qb. We were ready to move onto Fernando and did so. This also will prevent him from looking over his shoulder when he has a bad game too

There are so many things to like about this trade. Him coming off a real boner of a game and we still got a third? His best games against real losers of teams and we still got a third? A guy who cannot run and cannot throw effectively 20 plus yards and we still got a third? And a guy we really needed to move and the other team knew it and we still got a third?

Great deal for everyone. And yea, Cousins could come back next year with them. But he could also drop off during this year and die on the vine. You never know at 38 which is another reason we got fair market value. He is not Brady. He is Cousins and he is truly playing on borrowed time and everyone knows this.