Emo Andy Dalton after a trip to Sephora on Groundhog Day (Carr thread)

[RaiderandBulldog]

https://mobile.twitter.com/Raiders/stat ... 3878636548

[Trainnvain]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1040972]although, a case can be made that this polarization of the board is pretty accurate. A small but vocal group on both sides of the debate revert to "hater" or "Carr stan" whenever the debate escalates (and sometimes even when there is no escalation) to trigger the conversation. Even when it is pointed out that very few people actually hate him or blindly support him the comments continue. Even last night we had a member basically call all of us stupid.

Me personally, I am on neither side. I am not a fan of his decision making but there can be no denial that his arm is one of the better in the league right now. But when I say I could move onto a cheaper option to spread some money to positions I get blasted as a hater. It happens that simply. A comment that does not in any way indicate hatred for the guy immediately gets me labeled.

So while you are correct they serve no purpose but to drive a defining line between 2 sides, the underlying purpose is to trigger people. And to be quite honest, I see no real two sides among the majority even if they want to keep him or move on from him. I see one side with two opinions on how to best serve this team going forward. I only see two sides among a handful of people around here.[/quote]I generally agree that the vast majority of fans only want to see the a raiders improve, irrespective of who owns, coaches or piays for the team. But there is no denying that their is a very vocal minority that post triggering statements in order to inflame debate on this board and it works its way into nearly every thread.

[signal]

[quote=tactician post_id=1040975]The debate is settled. Carr...great guy, average quarterback. You could do worse but you could do better.[/quote]That is pretty much where I am. I think one of the reasons it is yet another hot topic this offseason is that this happens to be that offseason where a contract extension becomes a real possibility. And with a new GM and most probably an entire new coaching staff coming in, well, the direction of the Raiders is very much in the air.

My take is that if the Raiders had lost out in the final four games of the regular season but still averaged 19 points a game of offense in the last six as they have done, the entire discussion might be different.

What I saw, was the type of success that was completely unsustainable. And I think Mark saw it also. Hence, he is looking for a new GM and HC. And now the question is, do the Raiders sign Carr to an extension (which will be a hefty one) or do they they start making plans to move on?

Obviously this is not a 4 - 13 team; there is a foundation here....but what pieces need to stay and which pieces do the Raiders need to move on from. I do think Mark wants a Super Bowl contender and do think he is going about trying to make moves that will give the Raiders the best chance at that scenario.

So, yes, Carr is fine individual but is he the guy that can lead a team to a Super Bowl? Because with his contract extension coming up you will paying near top dollar for him to do so.

[Attyla]

[quote=Trainnvain post_id=1041009]I generally agree that the vast majority of fans only want to see the a raiders improve, irrespective of who owns, coaches or piays for the team. But there is no denying that their is a very vocal minority that post triggering statements in order to inflame debate on this board and it works its way into nearly every thread.[/quote]not only did not deny it, I basically said that. I said we should spend the money elsewhere, I am labeled a hater. It makes no sense but that is the go to for a small group. I have gotten to the point where I can sift through the bullshit and keep going. I have disdain for the term but there is little I can do about it.

[sdraider85]

If there was ever a time to replace Carr, the time is now. New GM/HC coming in and usually they will want their own guy. Not often do you see a holdover QB when these changes happen. The reason usually being that if the QB is pretty good the GM/HC usually aren’t being replaced. Although you do see scenarios like Chicago with a young rookie QB but in those cases the GM/HC have had years to right the ship and that was the last ditch effort.

[Trainnvain]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1041022]not only did not deny it, I basically said that. I said we should spend the money elsewhere, I am labeled a hater. It makes no sense but that is the go to for a small group. I have gotten to the point where I can sift through the bullshit and keep going. I have disdain for the term but there is little I can do about it.[/quote]I know, I’m agreeing with you

[RaiderandBulldog]

Amazing how much better a Qb does with a talented team around him.

[Jeremyturner1976]

https://www.espn.com/blog/las-vegas-rai ... derek-carr

Nothing groundbreaking. I just have not read much on keeping Carr from the media (Without a paywall).

[Raider727]

Carr threw 54x vs the bengals and only threw one td pass and was in the redzone 5x.

The Raiders were inside the 10 4x and kicked 3 field goals.

The Raiders were at the 9 yard line with a 1st down to get into overtime and Carr spiked it and went 0-3 game over.

Why didn't they put Mariota inside the 10?

I guarantee Mariota would have scored at least 1 td inside the 10.

Carr choked in the playoffs, no surprise.

[raiders93]

[quote=Jeremyturner1976 post_id=1041062]https://www.espn.com/blog/las-vegas-rai ... derek-carr

Nothing groundbreaking. I just have not read much on keeping Carr from the media (Without a paywall).[/quote]I think of us in contrast to the cowboys since we were both 1 and done.

- hard pressed to find many holes there. Had the #1 ranked o-line per pff. Top 10 ground game. Top 10 defence in points. #1 defence in takeaways. 2 star receivers. your other QBs in the division are Daniel Jones, Taylor heinecke, and Jalen hurts.

With us however…we were a playoff roster with some glaring holes. 28th ranked o-line per pff. 28th ranked rushing game in terms of yards. Defence was 26th in points allowed and had the 3rd fewest takeaways. Other QBs in our division are Mahomes, Herbert and bridgewater.

I think it’d take a coach with very long leash to move on from Carr (ie harbaugh). If you’re looking at this team pragmatically - I think the temptation is to play it safe at QB.

Address some of the glaring holes. Add a good right tackle. Replace Ruggs. Add some pieces to the back 7. This was already a playoff team with major weaknesses. Improve those and maybe we’re a real threat. If your QB replacement goes bad this is now a 4 win team.

Welcome to QB purgatory

[Jeremyturner1976]

Yes here we are, exactly where myself, Kinz, and a ton of other posters said we would be. Shocker.

One and done with Carr and stepping into a rebuild again 4 years after we should have moved on. Rookie contracts expiring left, right, and center. Carr had his chance to put up a sub 70 passer rating in a playoff game as expected and to play like crap to close out yet another season. No surprise.

If the new coach just loves picking from the 1st round scraps at 15-20 he will stay with Carr. If he has a desire to coach and win in a SuperBowl, he will not. I have no doubts Carr will return, he will get his extension - and one and done will remain this teams ceiling. Carr's upcoming price tag for mediocrity is a recipe for failure but Davis is willing to eat it all day long imo.

Heres to another dead end road... purgatory is the right word for it.

[RI RAIDER]

I like Carr. That being said, it is time to trade him. I would like a player and a 2023 1st. The 2023 class looks like it will be LOADED with QB's (unlike this year). With the cost savings and our draft picks, we should be able to fill some serious holes. Sign any decent QB (incentive laden) with a team option for year #2. Hopefully, he can do a good job keeping the seat warm. We would have 2 first round picks for 2023 and we make our move. The last thing I want is to take a step back while we finally tasted the playoffs. If we play our cards right, worst case, we may take it in the shorts short term. However, its a small price to pay for potential long term success (if we get the right guy). The AFC is loaded with young stud QB's and we desperately need one to compete.

[KillerRaider30]

We would have won the game had Jacobs gotten 13-17 more carries!
Just saying its about the win.

Carr dropped back 55 times
Carr ran the ball once.
JJ had 13 carries

55+13=68
68 offensive plays
13 is about 20% or 68.

If the Bengals play for pass 100% of the time, they would have chosen correctly 80%.

That's an easy win, for Cincinnati

Play action only works if you're committed to running
Play action works if you have success running
Jacobs was 13 for 85. 6y per
And had 4 catches for 44
10.4y per reception

Why didn't we lean on Jacobs
Why didn't the HC recognize this
Why did Olson call such a lopsided game
54/13 is NOT a balanced offense.

Its NOT Carr dummies

Or h a v e you not seen theres more going on.

Blinders I swear

[Jeremyturner1976]

[quote=KillerRaider30 post_id=1041247]We would have won the game had Jacobs gotten 13-17 more carries!
Just saying its about the win.

Carr dropped back 55 times
Carr ran the ball once.
JJ had 13 carries

55+13=68
68 offensive plays
13 is about 20% or 68.

If the Bengals play for pass 100% of the time, they would have chosen correctly 80%.

That's an easy win, for Cincinnati

Play action only works if you're committed to running
Play action works if you have success running
Jacobs was 13 for 85. 6y per
And had 4 catches for 44
10.4y per reception

Why didn't we lean on Jacobs
Why didn't the HC recognize this
Why did Olson call such a lopsided game
54/13 is NOT a balanced offense.

Its NOT Carr dummies

Or h a v e you not seen theres more going on.

Blinders I swear[/quote]When you are down 10 points, you don't run the football. Fuggn football 101 stuff.

Carr had a 70 passer rating (he put an absolute turd of a performance in the books), when we left it up to him to win. 80 or better passer rating (Still terrible) and we win that football game - end of story.

So yes - it is Carr. If we gave the ball to Jacobs 54 times and lost you could blame Jacobs. Hell you could even blame Olsen then because you pass alot when down by multiple scores - and run plays should not have been called.

Carr also had 16 turnovers in our final 11 games. Another late season collapse. Again - on Carr.

You should learn more about football before calling others dumb.

"RUN MORE DOWN BY 10" - ridiculous.

[Attyla]

of course the offensive output is mostly on Carr, the offense has gone through him all year. Play calling was crap but Carr has several audibles in his toolbelt on any given play. His pre snap reads were not good either. His play action? What play action? He does not have one.

But you get into the red zone and the game becomes too fast for him. We saw that on the last play, rushing a throw rather than take half a second for the second read to open up, and it was opening up, make no mistake. He was not being pressured so he should have taken a bit more time and not thrown into triple coverage,

[Jeremyturner1976]

[quote=Jeremyturner1976 post_id=1041248]When you are down 10 or more points in the second half, you don't run the football. Fuggn football 101 stuff.

Carr had a 70 passer rating (he put an absolute turd of a performance in the books), when we left it up to him to win. 80 or better passer rating (Still terrible) and we win that football game - end of story.

So yes - it is Carr. If we gave the ball to Jacobs 54 times and lost you could blame Jacobs. Hell you could even blame Olsen then because you pass alot when down by multiple scores - and run plays should not have been called.

Carr also had 16 turnovers in our final 11 games. Another late season collapse. Again - on Carr.

You should learn more about football before calling others dumb.

"RUN MORE DOWN BY 10" - ridiculous.[/quote]