Emo Andy Dalton after a trip to Sephora on Groundhog Day (Carr thread)

[RaiderandBulldog]

https://mobile.twitter.com/Raiders/stat ... 3878636548

[Attyla]

[quote=KillerRaider30 post_id=1071994]Ohh this offensive line is going to hold him back. I can feel it in my bones.

Carr gonna get squashed in under 2 seconds every play and we going to read how Carr can't complete down field throws bc he sucks. [/quote]building in the excuse early I see.

[kramNAVILLUS]

What is interesting is that Carr's record is 11-41 when the defense allows 30 points and greater. Using this record and the < 20 points record of 12-9, Carr's record when the defense allows 20-29 points is 34-20 (63%.win) - which roughly equates to a 10-6 record (using 16 game season). I'll take that any day.

It seems to me that Carr may have been handicapped by coaches on the <20 record (playing not to lose) rather than allowing him to be aggressive and play to win, which I feel the 20-29 points allowed better represents.

[KillerRaider30]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1071997]building in the excuse early I see.[/quote] lol, yes! I mean no.
Carr only needs a team around him and then watch out baby.

[Attyla]

I did "watch out baby" as he threw the ball into triple coverage 2 yards shy of the endzone.

[Jeremyturner1976]

[quote=kramNAVILLUS post_id=1071999]What is interesting is that Carr's record is 11-41 when the defense allows 30 points and greater. Using this record and the < 20 points record of 12-9, Carr's record when the defense allows 20-29 points is 34-20 (63%.win) - which roughly equates to a 10-6 record (using 16 game season). I'll take that any day.

It seems to me that Carr may have been handicapped by coaches on the <20 record (playing not to lose) rather than allowing him to be aggressive and play to win, which I feel the 20-29 points allowed better represents.[/quote]I like the first stat, but for aggressive QB play, perhaps the QB who throws short of the sticks more than most for the vast majority of his career, is the reason for a lack of aggressive play.

[KillerRaider30]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1072002]I did "watch out baby" as he threw the ball into triple coverage 2 yards shy of the endzone.[/quote]That drive was a game winning FG if Jackson doesn't drop the ball CARR hit him in the HANDS with earlier for a TD. Carr did enough to win that game.

[Jeremyturner1976]

[quote=KillerRaider30 post_id=1072005]That drive was a game winning FG if Jackson doesn't drop the ball CARR hit him in the HANDS with earlier for a TD. Carr did enough to win that game.[/quote]No, no he did not. One play does not excuse lower than a 55% completion rate and a sub 70 passer rating.

Maybe he should have sucked less over the course of the entire game?

He put up Jimmy G numbers, and we lost.

[Attyla]

[quote=KillerRaider30 post_id=1072005]That drive was a game winning FG if Jackson doesn't drop the ball CARR hit him in the HANDS with earlier for a TD. Carr did enough to win that game.[/quote]going to go out on your shield with this take?

[Raidernation1979]

Carr has played 127 games. In a quick count 64 so 1/2 of those games netted 20 points or less for the raiders. Roughly an average of 8 games a year he scores less then 20.

-- Tue Aug 16, 2022 9:37 am --

[quote=Attyla post_id=1072008]going to go out on your shield with this take?[/quote]It has to be somebody else’s fault. Never #4

[Attyla]

[quote=Raidernation1979 post_id=1072009]Carr has played 127 games. In a quick count 64 so 1/2 of those games netted 20 points or less for the raiders. Roughly an average of 8 games a year he scores less then 20.

-- Tue Aug 16, 2022 9:37 am --

It has to be somebody else’s fault. Never #4[/quote]honestly, I don't mind when people spread the wealth of blame for our results. I get it, team game and all, lots of moving parts. It is the utter and absolute pass this guy gets as the single most important cog in the wheel that I do not get. The throw to end the game? Absolutely 100% on Carr. There is not a playoff caliber QB out there that makes that throw 9 times out of 10. The open route, the fade to Waller, all he had to do is pump fake Bell off the spy coverage and it is six. Heck, he could have made that throw without the pump fake by lofting the ball since Waller had position to the flag.

So this is the QB thread and I admit I have never read so much about a defense or weapons in a QB thread ever. But whatever helps you sleep at night I guess

[Raidernation1979]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1072012]honestly, I don't mind when people spread the wealth of blame for our results. I get it, team game and all, lots of moving parts. It is the utter and absolute pass this guy gets as the single most important cog in the wheel that I do not get. The throw to end the game? Absolutely 100% on Carr. There is not a playoff caliber QB out there that makes that throw 9 times out of 10. The open route, the fade to Waller, all he had to do is pump fake Bell off the spy coverage and it is six. Heck, he could have made that throw without the pump fake by lofting the ball since Waller had position to the flag.

So this is the QB thread and I admit I have never read so much about a defense or weapons in a QB thread ever. But whatever helps you sleep at night I guess[/quote]Agreed. There is definitely plenty of blame to go around and a portion of that goes to the qb.

[Ismail86]

[quote=GoodTimeCharlie post_id=1071964]That may or may not be true. I don’t know any NFL players personally so I can’t vouch for what they say privately without cameras, microphones, journalists, and/or talking heads asking them questions.

Based on some fellas like Deshaun Watson, Ray Rice, Rae Carruth, Eric Naposki, Aaron Hernandez, Kellen Winslow Jr, and OJ Simpson, who they are in the public eye can be wildly different than who they are behind closed doors.

One day you’ll realize that those that no longer believe in Carr aren’t somehow stubborn and stuck in their ways. It’s the exact opposite if anything. They actually changed what they once thought. Myself included. Once upon a time WE ALL believed in Derek Carr. Or at least wanted to believe. In 2014 we were all fuckin’ high on possibility. Then every year, after more and more of watching Carr go fetal and shit the bed, reality breaks through the fantasy. As hard as it is for some of ya, y’all will get there someday.

Can’t say you weren’t given a heads-up.[/quote]Again, for the 4,000th time, I'm not a Carr guy. I have games where I hate him and games where I love him. I'm all for improving the QB position. All I'm saying is that there's a lot of players that speak very highly of him. Much more so than the players that speak negatively on him. Spin that to fit the narrative how you will but it's true. I also think that their opinion is more valid than anyone on page 504 of the "ABC" thread. Myself included.

[Opoponax50]

[quote=Ismail86 post_id=1072018]Can’t say you weren’t given a heads-up.[/quote]Again, for the 4,000th time, I'm not a Carr guy. I have games where I hate him and games where I love him. I'm all for improving the QB position. All I'm saying is that there's a lot of players that speak very highly of him. Much more so than the players that speak negatively on him. Spin that to fit the narrative how you will but it's true. I also think that their opinion is more valid than anyone on page 504 of the "ABC" thread. Myself included.[/quote]I think the best outside assessment of Carr that could be put in a nutshell was from the Colt's DC (or maybe DB) coach during last year's midseason Hard Knocks. During game planning he brought up a picture of Carr and it was apparent that the players in the room didn't take Carr all that seriously. But then the coach told them "This guy can get hot." It was a message to not underestimate Carr.

And in that game, that's exactly what happened. Carr was cold, cold, hot, hot, cold, and then got hot again at the end.

To me, that's Carr defined. When he's on his game, he's one of the best. However, he is inconsistent even within games. He gets shut down for long stretches in game and sometimes will and sometimes won't overcome it. That's the story of his career.

And given today's NFL, which was vividly illustrated during last season's playoffs, you have to have a QB who plays well consistently. Either that or hope the entire team gets on a hot streak at the right time.

[BluegrassRaider]

[quote=Attyla post_id=1070178]I will say this, and I am certainly not pointing specific fingers at anyone....but I do think there is a small group of people who hope the team fails so there is a stronger case to get rid of Carr. I am as critical as the next person when Carr does not measure up, but I am one who hopes for a win every week. Even during the dark dark days of Shell 2.0 I went into each game hoping for a win, but knowing it was futile. I do not think each game is futile with this squad. Carr's best season in 2016 we ran a similar offense. We did have a better line but the offense itself is similar if I am reading things correctly. I will certainly never question a fan's loyalty but hoping for a losing record to shed the team of a player? Utterly foreign to me.[/quote]I cheer for us to win like the roster is made up of my own sons but before and after, it is on. These are pros.

[BluegrassRaider]

[quote=KillerRaider30 post_id=1070283]I remember those.
CP had 8 "wins" with the Raiders in 2 years and then had 29 the next 3 years w the Cardinals as if by some magic he learned how to play.
Team doesn't matter yes[/quote]As does grabbing a guy off the couch and not expecting some rust and growing pains.